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What will USC do when the McNair records are released?

  • USC Outsider said...

    So, is USC going to financially support Todd in this legal battle?

    I don't believe Todd needs any financial assistance with a case like this. Some sharp law firmprobably took a look at the facts and agreed to represent him based upon a contingency payout for a portion of the settlement.

    brdcstr1

  • Question for one of the board lawyers:

    Based upon where this case is in the legal pipeline, how long would you guesstimate it would take to get in front of an actual jury if Todd decided to not settle with the NCAA?

    Just a thought, but wouldn't it be nice if some wealthy alums contacted Todd to guarantee him a payout of whatever the NCAA offers to settle for if he refused it and went to trial instead?

    That way, he's in a no lose situation while USC and all of college sports benefits.

    brdcstr1

  • brdcstr1 said...

    Question for one of the board lawyers:

    Based upon where this case is in the legal pipeline, how long would you guesstimate it would take to get in front of an actual jury if Todd decided to not settle with the NCAA?

    Just a thought, but wouldn't it be nice if some wealthy alums contacted Todd to guarantee him a payout of whatever the NCAA offers to settle for if he refused it and went to trial instead?

    That way, he's in a no lose situation while USC and all of college sports benefits.

    That's a good thought ... peace

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    USC Outsider ●

  • If the NCAA is found to have sanctioned USC without cause shouldn't the universities that the committee members are affiliated with be sactioned? I know it is a little far fetched but you have 1) individuals that are boasters and/or affiliated (current or former employees) of universities 2) that were responsible for sactioning an oppossing schools athletic program unjustly 3) for the sole purpose of benefiting their schools athletic porgrams through limiting the ability of USC to recruit, and field a competitive team. Two of these schools are Miami and Notre Dame. U of Miami was able to get the top OT recruit that had signed with USC but went to Miami after the sactions were announced. Notre Dame is about to play a depleted USC team for a bid to the NC game with some players that may have gone to USC if not for the sactions. I know it would never happen but would be a small victory and would make the NCAA members think twice before subjecting schools to unjust penalties.

    Fighton13

  • First off, if the LA Superior Court rules in favor of McNair, won't the NCAA appeal to the State Supreme Court? Then, if they lose that, won't they then appeal to the Federal Supreme Court? This could be years in the making of an eventual verdict/settlement.

    So, I don't see the NCAA relaxing the sanctions against us at all.

    When/if McNair is found to have been set up, I truly wonder if Haden/Nikias will go after the NCAA. We would have grounds to sue for money lost from no bowl games in 2010 and 2011, as well as all kinds of other "mental anguish" type stuff. But, I somehow doubt that the school's administration would do so.

    I have wondered for the past 22 months why the vast USC alumni base has not filed a class action law-suit against the NCAA. If every alum pitched in $100 that would be a fairly large war chest to do battle with. Also, I'm sure many Trojan alum attorneys would donate their time to the cause as well. I just hate that we appeared to have rolled over after getting rail-roaded with truly unfair penalties.

    I hope McNair wins, for his name and reputation, and for our school's reputation as well. Fight On, beat the NZAA!

    JCakus ●

  • Fighton13 said...

    If the NCAA is found to have sanctioned USC without cause shouldn't the universities that the committee members are affiliated with be sactioned? I know it is a little far fetched but you have 1) individuals that are boasters and/or affiliated (current or former employees) of universities 2) that were responsible for sactioning an oppossing schools athletic program unjustly 3) for the sole purpose of benefiting their schools athletic porgrams through limiting the ability of USC to recruit, and field a competitive team. Two of these schools are Miami and Notre Dame. U of Miami was able to get the top OT recruit that had signed with USC but went to Miami after the sactions were announced. Notre Dame is about to play a depleted USC team for a bid to the NC game with some players that may have gone to USC if not for the sactions. I know it would never happen but would be a small victory and would make the NCAA members think twice before subjecting schools to unjust penalties.

    I like your analysis and it makes sense, way too much sense in the world of Div. 1 NCAA football but A+ for your strategy ... peace

    signature image

    USC Outsider ●

  • jpltrojan1 said...

    Blem...sounds great but I have no confidence Nikias and Haden have the stomach for forcing anything in the way of a positive result.

    On its surface this looks like a great opportunity to end the sanctions.

    Sadly, have to agree 100% with your assessment.

    The subservient, passive, almost cowardly persona of USC as depicted in Pat Haden makes me cringe to even consider how he will further anger alumni and fans with his propensity to embarrass himself and denigrate his university.

    The next time he publicly speaks critically of any organization in collegiate athletics besides USC will be the first time.

    Road Scholar

    OkieTrojanFan1

  • I don't see the Todd McNair court case being settled until after USC has suffered all the sanctions.

    I am not a USC grad, outsider, but I do not understand the criticism of Pat Haden.

    The man is a Rhode Scholar, USC QB and NFL QB, obviously not an activity for a coward IMO.

    His style of AD leadership is intelligence as opposed to brute force. When the recent NCAA issues came up the NCAA commended Pat for his leadership in holding NCAA by-law workshops for any schools interested in attending. This and his efforts to keep USC clean and free of athletic scandal helped in the NCAA committee view of USC as being on the right track and deserving consideration.

    Pat left a lucrative and successful private practice to take on the task of the USC AD. One does not gain the success that Pat did being stupid. I think Pat has done more good than harm in his capacity as AD at USC.

    This post was edited by USC Outsider on 11/21/2012 at 10:58 PM

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  • USC Outsider said...

    I don't see the Todd McNair court case being settled until after USC has suffered all the sanctions.

    I am not a USC grad, outsider, but I do not understand the criticism of Pat Haden.

    The man is a Rhode Scholar, USC QB and NFL QB, obviously not an activity for a coward IMO.

    His style of AD leadership is intelligence as opposed to brute force. When the recent NCAA issues came up the NCAA commended Pat for his leadership in holding NCAA by-law workshops for any schools interested in attending. This and his efforts to keep USC clean and free of athletic scandal helped in the NCAA committee view of USC as being on the right track and deserving consideration.

    Pat left a lucrative and successful private practice to take on the task of the USC AD. One does not gain the success that Pat did being stupid. I think Pat has done more good than harm in his capacity as AD at USC.

    No doubt. He is superb, and dedicated to a winning program. His public statements mask his determination to win.

    But this development puts things in an entirely different light, and Lawyer Pat will see this clearly. The shoe is on the other foot. Our time to make a demand for restitution.

    laars

  • USC Outsider said...

    I don't see the Todd McNair court case being settled until after USC has suffered all the sanctions.

    I am not a USC grad, outsider, but I do not understand the criticism of Pat Haden.

    The man is a Rhode Scholar, USC QB and NFL QB, obviously not an activity for a coward IMO.

    His style of AD leadership is intelligence as opposed to brute force. When the recent NCAA issues came up the NCAA commended Pat for his leadership in holding NCAA by-law workshops for any schools interested in attending. This and his efforts to keep USC clean and free of athletic scandal helped in the NCAA committee view of USC as being on the right track and deserving consideration.

    Pat left a lucrative and successful private practice to take on the task of the USC AD. One does not gain the success that Pat did being stupid. I think Pat has done more good than harm in his capacity as AD at USC.

    I really don't intend this to be sarcastic, but have you followed this saga since PH became AD at USC?

    If so, I truly find it hard to believe that anyone familiar with the substance of the situation, regardless of their opinions, cannot see numerous reasons for criticism of Pat Haden's representation of USC's reputation and interests in the public forum.

    Pat Haden has been Neville Chamberlain when Winston Churchill was needed.

    Road Scholar

    OkieTrojanFan1

  • Fighton13 said...

    If the NCAA is found to have sanctioned USC without cause shouldn't the universities that the committee members are affiliated with be sactioned?

    In other words...what's the penalty when the NCAA is proven to have demonstrated a lack of institutional control?

    Knowing them....a pay raise for everyone.

    brdcstr1

  • laars said...

    But this development puts things in an entirely different light, and Lawyer Pat will see this clearly. The shoe is on the other foot. Our time to make a demand for restitution.

    laars, I'm seeing things from an entirely different perspective now.

    With these recent revelations from the judge, USC owes it to every other NCAA member school to stand up to governing body entrusted with ensuring fairness across the board.

    The quote that comes to mind I would share with Pat/Nikias is "Evil abounds when good men do nothing". If USC does nothing, then they become complicit in the corruption.

    The NCAA has shown themselves to be no different than corrupt cops who frame innocent people for crimes they didn't commit. Hopefully they aren't allowed to run roughshod over one other program.

    brdcstr1

  • According to Garry P on TOS USC's stance on the sanctions isn't changing. Not really a surprise.

    jpltrojan1

  • Haden comes out looking pretty weak with this exposure of the NCAA, even if he was just following orders from higher ups. He went out of his way to suck up to the NCAA and call then fair-minded individuals, tell all of us that we had "tin foil hats" for believing there was malice and a conspiracy against USC, actively dismissed USC's opportunity to challenge the NCAA findings based on the Auburn outcome (Nikias drove that one), and generally did everything possible to keep the fanbase from demanding justice.

    If Haden truly believed that a lawsuit was not worth the effort given the narrow legal avenue to pursue relief, that's one thing. But nothing stopped him from calling a press conference and going through the NCAA report with all of the misstatements, lies, omissions, etc., that are now coming up in this lawsuit for McNair. We could have easily accepted the penalties but defended our name in the process and let a fire under the press to examine how the NCAA could possibly come to this level of punishment based on such a shoddy case. Look what happened with Shabazz the second UCLA and the press pushed back.

    Instead, Haden has been complicit in moving USC in a direction he thought was best (along with Nikias, et al.) but now that this new information comes out regarding malice, he and USC looks rather foolish and timid for not standing up for itself.

    Hopefully this new information provides USC a third chance to stand up and use this finding and the reference to biased investigative work as a means to demand from the NCAA--of which it is a member--fairness and justice, and in particular access to these emails and communications that the NCAA is trying to suppress.

    Haden demonstrated leadership--just in the wrong direction with the wrong tone (i.e., "win the right way"), and it's coming full circle now.

    Trojanhoya

  • Oh, and McNair being let go by USC is actually the strength of his case to demonstrate he suffered financial damages and was unable to find work, because USC didn't choose to test the "show cause" restriction placed on McNair. So USC did him a favor by not retaining him, in regards to this lawsuit.

    Trojanhoya

  • OkieTrojanFan1 said...

    Sadly, have to agree 100% with your assessment.

    The subservient, passive, almost cowardly persona of USC as depicted in Pat Haden makes me cringe to even consider how he will further anger alumni and fans with his propensity to embarrass himself and denigrate his university.

    The next time he publicly speaks critically of any organization in collegiate athletics besides USC will be the first time.

    You and JPL Trojan are vastly underestimating these men
    You will realize that at some point

    BlemBlam3 ●

  • jpltrojan1 said...

    According to Garry P on TOS USC's stance on the sanctions isn't changing. Not really a surprise.

    He is wrong

    BlemBlam3 ●

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    BlemBlam3 ●

  • Kravis said...

    3 things stick out in the AP article on the McNair case:

    1. 'The NCAA had sought to have the case dismissed, but Shaller disagreed. He said after reviewing sealed documents in the McNair inquiry, which was tied to a gift scandal involving Heisman Trophy-winner Reggie Bush, he was convinced that the actions of NCAA investigators were 'over the top.' His ruling states emails between an investigative committee member, an NCAA worker and a person who works in the agency's appeals division 'tend to show ill will or hatred' toward McNair.'

    2. 'Shaller said he would unseal the entire inquiry into McNair, but would hold off on release of the records for a month to allow an appeal. 'I think the public has a right to know,' he said.'

    3. 'McNair's attorney Bruce Broillet declined comment, citing the sealing order in the case. He said during the hearing that the records showed the agency knew it was relying on false statements about McNair's conduct and wanted to 'nail' the coach, who also played in the NFL.'

    In 1 month, the McNair records will potentially be released for everyone to review. If the records indeed show malice towards McNair (and by proxy USC) and reliance on false statements to punish McNair/USC, what does USC do? USC has already voluntarily accepted the NCAA's ruling but can the university stand idle if new public information clearly points to egregious conduct by the NCAA. Obviously everyone suspects this but doesn't the ballgame change if 'suspected' malice is now 'confirmed' malice? Can the NCAA continue to hide behind their processes and procedures if the record shows lack of institutional control by the NCAA on the USC case?

    I don't expect USC to sue the NCAA but would it not at least warrant USC asking the NCAA for immediate relief? Even if it's only partial relief.

    The PSU case shows the NCAA is capable of moving incredibly fast when it wants to so they could even make a ruling before February 2013 NSD (ok ok I'm being overly optimistic). Regardless, if the records are as bad as the judge says it is, the notion of not getting any relief for the 2014 class seems crazy to me.

    Is this a game changer or homer optimism?

    Game changer.

    If the records are unsealed before February, and they show exactly what the judge was talking about, we should not only get relief for the 2013 class we should be able to add 10 more players for the kids we lost last year.

    And watch Kiffin STILL f*ck it up.

    I don't know if Haden has the cajones to do this but he might want to get ahead of this and call up the NCAA to offer them a chance to make USC whole prior to the unsealing of the records. It might allow them to retain the last shred of respectability they have.

    Also, what would be the possibility of Pete suing the NCAA if the records show the NCAA had a vendetta out for him? I think the university could sue (and would be on better ground than Tarkanian) on the basis that they agreed to the findings of the NCAA on the assumption that the process was fair and involved no malice.

    This post was edited by oldtrojan_93 on 11/22/2012 at 8:04 AM

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    oldtrojan_93

  • BlemBlam3 said...

    He is wrong

    Interesting, How so?

    Maybe once the files are released Haden would change his mind, but I am not seeing right now.He had a chance to set the tone early but passed.

    guess we will find out...but I think the NCAA will appeal and find some relief and then its back to square 1.

    ParagonSC

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