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I think this has been a good discussion and people are making very valid points. One thing that hasn't been brought up though is "Are the kids playing down to the intensity of their coach?"
Coach K says some witty things from time to time, but most of the time he seems like a robot, very dry, lack of emotion. If you had a kid that normally was amped up, this might bring down the kid's intensity.
I remember Kiffin's first year, in fact, he said this. That they really try to tone down the kids on gameday. There's something to be said to not blowing your wad before kickoff, but if they are pushing the kid's to "chill", you can have kids too chill.
It's a balance. And each kid has a different personality. What are the optimal qualities of a coach to motivate a team collectively, is a great question.
While your at it tell the president that.... It starts at the top and when the United States President is giving everything a way for free the kids learn from a young age they dont have to do shit.. JMO..
Psst!!!! This shift started in the 90's while the conservative president was in the office. Let's try and stay away from the political aspect of this because it starts in the home not at 1600 Penn Ave.
Well, since their performance over the course of the year was the reason why they ended up in El Paso, they should be held somewhat accountable. If I were head coach, after that fiasco of a season and a bowl game, I would tell each and every player that their scholarship and their playing time next year is based on how they do in spring practice, pre-season practice, and in each and every practice and game of the season. Let's get back to the Pete Carroll approach of compete, compete, compete. Saving the players in practice because of depth issues didn't turn out so well this year, did it?
It all comes down to Bush's Medicare drug plan. Got it.
Come on, people. Sitting in judgment of today's kids like your generation was really any better.
Monty Python - Four Yorkshiremen
This post was edited by swr22 18 months ago
I agree and trust me my home and business do just fine... The fact is I have never heard more excusses from adults then in the last 8 years.. My point was we give everybody passes now for whatever reason to people, sports ect. Teams that stay great dont compromise for shit.. New England, Pitts, Yankees and the whole damn SEC for that matter. I love SC as much as the next fan but the reason we are a laughing stock right now is because there are people still willing to protect LK.. I mean call a spade a spade. The spring games I attended this year along with countless practices were the most boring shit I have ever seen. Young people will conform to whatever system you apply, however at USC its not a laid back wear your FN sunglasses like your hollywood on the sidelines when the weather was cloudy.. Its a bunch of guys that were hard nosed badasses. When you walk down the coli staduim look on the walls and tell me if you can find one ex player that wasnt bad. This soft spoken shit and everythings a secret is for high school coaches that are ego freaks.. Real men conduct themselves with zero bullshit JMO.
This post was edited by trinity 18 months ago
No offense, however, all I read from that is a bunch of excuses. I know Kessler is your guy, however, you're reaching big time.
You're using spring ball as your gauge? Um...okay?
I don't know what 'real men' do. I imagine they are too busy being themselves to worry if they are being 'real men' or knowing what that is.
I don't think our O-Line really bullied an opponent's D-Line, I think we turned the ball over too often, and I think our playcalling was uninspired (particularly on D). I think 'today's kids' and 'real men' are probably the grumble of people too insecure about false generational declines or gender roles.
I dont make excusses for one thing.. Second, kessler should of played the end. He beat Wittek out last year and this year. I watched it with my own eyes. . I want the best kids to play period. I mean Flourney had one of the best camps of anybody I didnt see him getting any playing time? All I have seen of Farmer is he is a complete freak, I mean those that dont get to see it in practice hear about it here. And do we see farmer playing..... No. So how am I reaching? I have a question for you TW1, the whole country watched Wittek play as bad as you can play and Kiffin never made a change to win that game. Your telling me that he didnt see that? Well maybe he missed all spring DV light it up GF tear it up and he had to of seen MB throw INT after INT in spring right that lead to a dissapointing season for MB. And trust me MB in my mind will go down as one of the greatest Trojans ever for his commitment to a school his family and most important his teamates. Like I said I dont make excusses I just call it like I see it..
Your right reall men dont need to play childish games with the media and others, I agree. Also I agree the Oline was pretty damn bad. I remember SS posting something about Marcus Martin saying he felt they had turned soft. Is that the system or did the kids wake up one day as a unit and go shit... today we are turning soft.
Like I said...you're way too biased for this convo.
As far as Farmer is concerned, and I have watched this "kid" since he was a Frosh at Serra...he may very well end up being the next Stanley Guyness....If he does not make an impact next season.
I am not sure. They were pretty good last year, so my guess is that it isn't generational decline, the Obama administration, or the moon being above Jupiter during their birthstone month. Probably the O-Line coaching.
Thats the point.... You cant make a impact from the sidelines. I agree.
that was deserved...
Everyone loves the HC when they're winning games. I don't remember anyone talking about how Kiffin had lost the locker room last year or players not respecting him. It's the same as with the fan base. No one complains when they're "eating" (getting receptions, carries, sacks, interceptions, playing time, etc.)
Wow. Pretty much sums up your point on the topic.
I disagree with the whole premise of this thread. Unless I've misinterpreted it, your assertion is that people complaining about Kiffin's demeanor are off base because it's the players, who are an extension of a lazy generation, who can't motivate themselves? So what about every other team in the country, including Bama and Notre Dame, who stock their rosters with the same lazy, babied players from this generation? They have seemed to somehow find a way to get up in the morning and have fairly successful seasons. In my opinion, the lion's share of the blame for this inexcusable season has to fall on Kiffin's shoulders but I don't attribute any of that to his low key attitude. I'm of the belief that there's many ways to reach players. Whether it's X's and O's- Chip Kelly, Fear- Nick Saban, or rah rah- PC, there's plenty of ways to motivate kids and as a poster stated earlier, it helps to have a mixture of styles. However, you can make the argument that Kiffin wasn't really effective with any aspect of technical coaching or motivation this season. Not a good recipe for a successful season
You can disagree until you're blue in the face. This has nothing to do with Kiffin's sideline demeanor.
So yes, I believe you misinterpreted.
If there is one thing that Lane Kiffin can not be called, it is lazy.
The scholarship guarantees a recruit admission -- what they do with that opportunity is completely up to them. It does not ensure playing time, starting, or havingTim T start a Heisman campaign in your honor.
They're given every tool imaginable to be successful.
College football is chalk-full of great players being coached by mediocre coaching staffs. They rise up and realize their potential due to their own motivation, accountability and desire.
Actions speak louder than words.
Players whom took action....like Steve Smith, Robert Woods, Matt Grootegoed, Clay Matthews and Stanley Havili prove that principle.
Kiffin's responsibility to develop, maximize and squeeze every ounce of talent, out of every scholarship, is a whole different story...for an entirely different thread.
This is the correct answer. Our players aren't lazy or entitled.
It is not necessary to be a rah-rah guy to be effective. You just need to be a leader and have the players buy into the system. Every player has a different button to push to get the maximum out of them and it is up to the coach to find out what that is and to effectively use it.
What does it say about your leadership style when the head coach and person who calls the offensive plays has never spoken to one of the starting offensive linemen? Do you think someone wants to run through a fire to play for that kind of a guy, the same guy whose team got caught deflating balls, changing numbers, etc?
Posted on another thread, but I think for this discussion it bears repeating. My two (ok, three) cents... TW you agree?
I'm a big believer in leading by example.. My livelihood DEPNDS on my ability not only to compose music but to teach it to others to either record it or perform in live under my direction.
I use CPC'a core pholosophies in my daily work: 1. Be Early 2. Protect the music/show and 3. No complaining. Very simple. I encourage the musicians and singers I work with to have fun by having fun myself... EVEN IF I'M IN A CRAPPY MOOD!!! I have found over the years I record music faster than other people. Why? Leadership and preparation. It is my job to motivate them. And yes, being on a podium or behind a piano is slightly different than being on the sidelines I imagine. But I can spot a great leader regardless. CLK's demeanor isn't as much of a factor (it compounds the problem at worst) inasmuch as his inability to prepare and adjust properly.
If a singer isn't working out or a deadline is approaching and a player isn't nailing the part I adjust. I tell them to take a break, or to "tacet" (not play) during a take with a backup plan to record someone else. I always have alternate plans in place. As yes, even In Professional music (especially theater), I have to coach and encourage adults to make them feel confident, make them want to achieve a better performance. They never see me yawn, or get fatigued, or seem disinterested in the music. I never make it hard or over complicated from a teaching standpoint. I set them up to succeed.
It's all about leading by example, being exceptionally well prepared, and being able to adjust to getting the best you can out of the talent you're working with. I don't just think that. I live it.
Join the fight for YOUR liberty!
Quite the conversation. I do not feel the need to defend CLK. I will say the cumulative events prior to the end of this season have produced a terrible uphill battle for this guy. It seemed that he was doomed from the start when you consider the Tennessee and Raider fiascos followed by several faux pas this year. He does not have the personality on the field that PC had. We can only guess what his relationship is with his players. If you judge his recruiting ability I would guess he has something going with them. We speculate a lot over here but do not know.
I played and later coached for 14 years. When I was getting recruited it was a different ball game. We did not have all of the social media, internet, televised games and media attention from the time we were 14 years on. We got letters, visits, phone calls and in home visits occasionally. Our coaches also helped promote us. We made the decision based on where we could get the best education, family considerations and potential play time. Some of this has not changed. What has changed is that the pressure on these kids is a lot more. Many think that they are bigger than the schools that are recruiting them. It has become a circus. Now these kids have fan clubs and people twittering them from different fan bases contributing this self centeredness. I am old school. I have not strapped it on for almost 50 years. I am not crazy about once a person commits to a school then decommits. I understand the pressure these kids are under now, but I guess I have a hard time understanding all of this behavior.
Perhaps all of this season is an anomaly as someone said. If he would have been 10-2 we might not be having this discussion. Our expectations were sky high. Perhaps we have listened to our own hype. We had only one real good game this year. We probably did not realize the loss of players through graduation and injury that changed what we were able to do. This can be fixed without firing CLK. Many great suggestions have come from this board. Let's hope that this is an anomaly and that we can come back next year with a fury.
This post was edited by Troybill 18 months ago
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