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247 Rankings

  • I am by no means trying to stir the pot here. I just have a legitiamte questiona and topic for debate.

    First, let me say that I am a faithful patron of this site and value its insight regarding recruiting. However:

    Why are 247 analysts hard-pressed to give 5-star status?

    I ask because: 1) Ty Isaac is only a four-star 2) Justin Davis is only a four-star who didn't even break the top 200 as a player 3) Greg Bryant is ranked higher than Davis and isn't Davis faster and a bit longer? 4) only sixteeen national players are worthy of 5-star status on this site

    What, essetially, is the main difference in player evaluation between 247 and, say, the other popular sites such as Scout and Rivals?

    I've been trying to figure this out for a while now.

    westcoastrules

  • westcoastrules said...

    I am by no means trying to stir the pot here. I just have a legitiamte questiona and topic for debate.

    First, let me say that I am a faithful patron of this site and value its insight regarding recruiting. However:

    Why are 247 analysts hard-pressed to give 5-star status?

    I ask because: 1) Ty Isaac is only a four-star 2) Justin Davis is only a four-star who didn't even break the top 200 as a player 3) Greg Bryant is ranked higher than Davis and isn't Davis faster and a bit longer? 4) only sixteeen national players are worthy of 5-star status on this site

    What, essetially, is the main difference in player evaluation between 247 and, say, the other popular sites such as Scout and Rivals?

    I've been trying to figure this out for a while now.

    Rivals is similar to 247 in that they usually only have between 20-25 5-stars each year. On Scout, the top 50 players are 5 star players.

    In terms of ranking the players.....I gave up a long time ago trying to figure out how a player can be a top 20 player on one board and not even a top 200 player on another.

    TrojanTW

  • TrojanTW said...

    Rivals is similar to 247 in that they usually only have between 20-25 5-stars each year. On Scout, the top 50 players are 5 star players.

    In terms of ranking the players.....I gave up a long time ago trying to figure out how a player can be a top 20 player on one board and not even a top 200 player on another.

    I would say it is all about perspective and how each sites' evaluators view a player. Even then, the most important factor is how a coach will view a player. If you need proof of that, look at USC getting Marcus Martin. Was a three-star G across the board on each site. Became largely effective first year starter. I don't look at stars or rankings, mainly focus on the player's tape.

    BrandonWilliams

  • westcoastrules said...

    I am by no means trying to stir the pot here. I just have a legitiamte questiona and topic for debate.

    First, let me say that I am a faithful patron of this site and value its insight regarding recruiting. However:

    Why are 247 analysts hard-pressed to give 5-star status?

    I ask because: 1) Ty Isaac is only a four-star 2) Justin Davis is only a four-star who didn't even break the top 200 as a player 3) Greg Bryant is ranked higher than Davis and isn't Davis faster and a bit longer? 4) only sixteeen national players are worthy of 5-star status on this site

    What, essetially, is the main difference in player evaluation between 247 and, say, the other popular sites such as Scout and Rivals?

    I've been trying to figure this out for a while now.

    See below:

    About our rankings and ratings

    Our rankings are different than others in the sense that they constantly act as a "big board" of sorts with prospects moving up and down frequently.

    There is no standard "release" time for an update as we let the discovery process dictate that. We also do not set a pre-determined number of prospects to rank in states and at positions nationally- we simply rank as many as we can.



    Already for the Class of 2013, we have ranked a significant number of prospects. 



    Link: Prospect Rankings

    Ratings Scale

    At 247Sports, each recruit that we evaluate will be assigned a numerical rating as well as a star rating. The rankings are determined by our recruiting analysts after hours of personal observations, film evaluation and input from our network and other reliable sources of information.

Players are ranked by position, grouped qualitatively with a star ranking and given a numerical ranking based on their future potential. The explanation for the numerical rankings is below.



    110 - 101 = A player ranked in this range is a "franchise player." He is one of the best to come along in years - if not decades (LeBron James, Adrian Peterson). Odds of having a player in this category every year is slim. This prospect has “can’t miss” talent.



    100 - 98 = Five-star prospect. One of the top 25 or so prospects in the nation. Player has excellent pro potential, and should emerge as one of the best players in the country before his college career ends.



    97 - 90 = Four-star prospect. Prospect will be an impact-player for his college team. All-America candidate who displays pro potential. Typically one of the top 300 players in the nation.



    89 - 80 = Three-star prospect. These are the players who will develop into reliable starters for the college teams. They are among the best players in their region of the country, and are generally among the top 750 players in the nation.



    79 - below = Two-star prospect. These players make up the bulk of Division I rosters. They may have little pro potential, are likely to become role players for their respective schools or not enough is known about the prospect to rank them accurately.

    Philosophy

    Our philosophy, to account for the accelerated recruiting process, is to rank prospects earlier in their high school careers than what has been previously done in this business. Because a player can develop dramatically or not in a 2-3 year period in the sport of football, that’s going to make for greater movement in the rankings.

    So it’s not out of the question that a player is No. 8 to begin with and finishes at No. 90 or he’s No. 187 and finishes No. 12. The delta for the player’s final ranking (which is what matters and what we should be judged on in that regard) is much wider during a 24-36 month period than an 8-12 month period.

    

Think of it (and I use this comparison often) as an NFL Draft “big board”. Two years out, a player may be projected as a top five pick, but when all is said and done, after seasons on the field, combines and pro days, other types of evaluations, etc., he may slip to the third round or so.

I certainly am not saying that we are justified if we have a kid start out as a five star with a rating of 102 and end up as a two star with a rating of 75. That’s drastic and inconsistent. But we’ve found that it’s human nature for fans to look at a 30-40 spot drop in rankings and wonder what their favorite prospect going to their school “did wrong” or why we “don’t think he’s good”. Well, the drop doesn’t mean either, it just means when we re-adjusted everything, including the rankings of other prospects, said prospect fell to that particular point in the rankings. 


    Rankings are fun for fans to debate, celebrate, complain about, etc., and they are fun for us to put together. That’s why we are going to push the envelope and get rankings out earlier- so you guys can enjoy them and learn about the prospects at an earlier date- so during things like junior days and late winter/early spring combines- you can really dig in and get a true sense of what is going on inside your favorite football program. We do this for you guys.

    Three new Five-Stars

    Three new five-star prospects highlight the latest release of the 2013 Top247.

    247sports.com
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    TrojanWarrior1

  • westcoastrules said...

    I am by no means trying to stir the pot here. I just have a legitiamte questiona and topic for debate.

    First, let me say that I am a faithful patron of this site and value its insight regarding recruiting. However:

    Why are 247 analysts hard-pressed to give 5-star status?

    I ask because: 1) Ty Isaac is only a four-star 2) Justin Davis is only a four-star who didn't even break the top 200 as a player 3) Greg Bryant is ranked higher than Davis and isn't Davis faster and a bit longer? 4) only sixteeen national players are worthy of 5-star status on this site

    What, essetially, is the main difference in player evaluation between 247 and, say, the other popular sites such as Scout and Rivals?

    I've been trying to figure this out for a while now.

    Maybe it's just me, but I actually like it when sites don't give out so many five stars. For example, Scout gives out way to many 5 stars and even though a Scout.com 5 star is different from an ESPN or 247 5 star, it still gives the perception that a player is that caliber when he may actually not be at that level.

    On the flip side, however, a site like ESPN gives out just a handful of 5 stars and it makes to me it keeps kids underrated that probably have a lot more talent than is shown.

    me9rob

  • Tell you the truth...I pay zero attention to where this site, or any of the others rank these players. I trust Scott, and our coaching staff to tell me who fits our program. Only time I'm aware of the rankings is because it's included in an article Scott or Chris writes.

    This is the same staff that brought in unheralded players who turned out to be great for us...during our championship seasons, and now.

    Fight On!

    This post was edited by usctrojan1 on 4/18/2012 at 4:00 PM

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    "Here are provided seats of meditative joy, where shall rise again the destined reign of Troy." Virgil

    usctrojan1

  • TW1 - how many people are weighing in on the rankings? Does 24/7 have "scouts" all across the nation that cover a certain region? Do they talk to coaches or is it all just based on their review? How do you guys even hear about some of these kids? Is it word of mouth? I can't imagine the amount of kids watched and high schools visited.

    JCakus

  • JCakus said...

    TW1 - how many people are weighing in on the rankings? Does 24/7 have "scouts" all across the nation that cover a certain region? Do they talk to coaches or is it all just based on their review? How do you guys even hear about some of these kids? Is it word of mouth? I can't imagine the amount of kids watched and high schools visited.

    I can't speak for the 24/7 crew, but a lot of the kids I hear about from the other regions towards the east are word of mouth. Then I do my own evaluating.

    BrandonWilliams

  • Some recruit somewhere is reading this thread and laughing his ass off

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    I will not be working with you, but against you. - USC Outsider

    USCMichigander

  • JCakus said...

    TW1 - how many people are weighing in on the rankings? Does 24/7 have "scouts" all across the nation that cover a certain region? Do they talk to coaches or is it all just based on their review? How do you guys even hear about some of these kids? Is it word of mouth? I can't imagine the amount of kids watched and high schools visited.

    Honestly I have no idea as to how many...I'm sure Scott can answer that when he sees the thread. Yes, they do have scouts/analysts that cover regions, however, I would surmise that most of their evaluations are based off of film and discussions with coaches.

    I hear about these kids the same way you do...by reading the boards and having friends in the right places.

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    TrojanWarrior1

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    Scott Schrader